tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post827720508882161333..comments2024-01-30T12:26:03.019-05:00Comments on The Blog of Garnel Ironheart: But Where Does The Trend EndMighty Garnel Ironhearthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09571194550300367249noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-15595434913163392122012-06-15T10:11:51.161-04:002012-06-15T10:11:51.161-04:00I'm not sure if any of us will be able to pred...I'm not sure if any of us will be able to predict the future. Sure, we can look at trends and graphs - but those would have utterly failed to predict the course of events in the Jewish community during the 20th century.<br /><br />Could those in the shtetl who thought that the main argument was between Hasidim and Mitnagdim have predicted that so many would flee pogroms and emigrate?<br /><br />Could those early Reformers have predicted that the German culture which they loved would spawn the Nazis and lead to the Holocaust?<br /><br />Could those who predicted the disappearance of Orthodoxy in pre-war North America have predicted its resurgence?<br /><br />When I met some Soviet relatives in June, 1989, did I dream that I would next see them in Israel in 1993?<br /><br />I have no idea what events will bring.<br /><br />I can guess that we will see new movements and definitions emerging. Some of the older institutional structures may make less sense. However, while the formal Conservative movement may decline if it doesn't reinvent itself, I don't think that the niche will. From what I see, there is still a sizeable group of Jews that aren't anti-religion and that want a connection to traditional Judaism, but aren't insular and want Halacha with some flexibility. It's just that today, I see this group attending Chabad. I suspect that some people will become less concerned with labels (witness the growth of Limmud, for example). The old focus on Jewish continuity will be acknowledged to be a failure (because really, would you join any group whose members constantly whine that they aren't sure if they are going to be around much longer?). At the same time, there may be more of a reach, particularly in the more liberal settings, to non-Jews and those who are intermarried, because it's hard to both whine that your numbers are dwindling and work to exclude people. In Israel, there will continue to be a growth in non-Orthodox forms of spirituality which look entirely different from Reform or Conservative, and which are likely inspired by Eastern religions.Law momhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01859590966207623757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-79585038063354737402012-06-15T06:11:24.824-04:002012-06-15T06:11:24.824-04:00not everyone is sick of it. not me.not everyone is sick of it. not me.Avraham https://www.blogger.com/profile/07822433921393627746noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-27830972653628860882012-06-14T10:41:33.584-04:002012-06-14T10:41:33.584-04:00How about nothing will take its place.
Everyone i...How about nothing will take its place.<br /><br />Everyone is sick of Judaism some jews are just more willing to admit it than others.SJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10704885840004960450noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-44485409413359507172012-06-14T10:22:04.253-04:002012-06-14T10:22:04.253-04:00Neil, the question is what the coming economic uph...Neil, the question is what the coming economic upheaval along with the increasing global influence of radical Islam will mean for this next generation.Mighty Garnel Ironhearthttp://garnelironheart.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-37663790029891208522012-06-13T17:41:24.983-04:002012-06-13T17:41:24.983-04:00I think the next generation will be idealistic and...I think the next generation will be idealistic and fairly moderate.<br /><br />Using the Strauss-Howe generational theory (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss-Howe_generational_theory) the next generation will be the "prophet generation". <br /><br /> <br />"Prophet generations (dominant) are born after a Crisis, during a time of rejuvenated community life and consensus around a new societal order. Prophets grow up as the increasingly indulged children of this post-Crisis era, come of age as self-absorbed young crusaders of an Awakening, focus on morals and principles in midlife, and emerge as elders guiding another Crisis.[25] Due to this location in history, such generations tend to be remembered for their coming-of-age fervor and their values-oriented elder leadership. Their main societal contributions are in the area of vision, values, and religion." (from wiki entry)Neil Harrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12797772082427806345noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-66216670631216556472012-06-13T16:44:01.428-04:002012-06-13T16:44:01.428-04:00There never was that "important" center ...There never was that "important" center and we managed just fine.<br /><br />BTW your sentiments (babies vs. conferences) would strongly support the Haredi viewpoint, would it not? The growth we're seeing is not from the 3 child and growing smaller MO families.harediandproudhttp://harediandproud.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-87462932308095974522012-06-13T14:45:07.032-04:002012-06-13T14:45:07.032-04:00What defines success? Numbers only? How many of ...What defines success? Numbers only? How many of those Orthodox Jews are under the age of 18? They don't really have too many choices.<br />The true test is the adults. As a product of an interfaith marriage turned BT, I get annoyed at the idea of an interfaith marriage meaning Episcopalian grandkids. My mother married out, her sister didn't Guess whose grandkids have the greatest sense of Jewish identity? <br />As for moderation, I think that will happen when the current crop of yeshiva bochurim marry off their daughters and find out what it means to be on the giving end of that sort of support.AztecQueen2000https://www.blogger.com/profile/09371826731550331938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-63174937569588922772012-06-13T14:05:25.574-04:002012-06-13T14:05:25.574-04:00I actually think that the next generation will be ...I actually think that the next generation will be the backlash to this extremism and will want to be more moderate.<br />I'll just wait until they all catch up to me. ;)Sparrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03353090248571385006noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-13640393273616191972012-06-13T12:54:29.525-04:002012-06-13T12:54:29.525-04:00In fifty years the truly devout will look very dif...In fifty years the truly devout will look very different from the secular. The secular Jew will be a curiosity – a rarity. The devout Jew will get much closer to the Amish – living a life truly apart.<br /><br />The one thing that could throw a wrench in the works is if the government stops offering generous welfare benefits. That would stress the Orthodox Jew, and perhaps force him back into mainstream society. Then we would have a new flowering of Modern Orthodoxy.<br /><br />Finally, sometime around the year six thousand – if moshiach has not arrived – Judaism will face a crisis. Some will leave, angry. Others will rewrite the tradition, let everyone know it really is ok, and that it turns out the year seven thousand is what matters.<br /><br />TuviaAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com