tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post8838788204810209770..comments2024-01-30T12:26:03.019-05:00Comments on The Blog of Garnel Ironheart: Is The Amud For Everybody?Mighty Garnel Ironhearthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09571194550300367249noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-16403324540955354862013-02-19T11:11:36.824-05:002013-02-19T11:11:36.824-05:00http://www.jewishideas.org/articles/i-dread-going-...http://www.jewishideas.org/articles/i-dread-going-shulDaniel B. Schwartznoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-69374158344273496552013-02-06T20:44:27.828-05:002013-02-06T20:44:27.828-05:00I think the most important requirements for a serv...I think the most important requirements for a service leader are ability (Hebrew and tune) and, for lack of a better term, middos-- which is to say, don't honor someone who engages in bad behavior by elevating them over other members of the community.<br /><br />Theological positions, IMO, are not relevant to the position. The leader is not wrapping everyone else's prayers and Fed-Exing them to God. Your prayers will not get lost in the mail if they have a crappy voice, or Heaven forbid, don't believe the correct theology. I don't believe that's how prayer works (starting, of course, from the premise that prayer "works" at all).<br /><br />As I see it, the leader's role should be to inspire others to daven with as much spirit, sincerity or purpose as they can. If they are able to do this, it shouldn't matter what they believe. As I understand it, the focus for Jews is on actions, not beliefs. We don't have a thought police or a telepathy reader. How can you *really* know what someone believes in or is thinking about during davening, or leining, or giving a drash, or studying Talmud, or anything else? For all you know your shaliach tzibur could be fantasizing about bacon, or your rebbe could be planning his next vacation, or your Torah reader could be picturing Noah on a surfboard. I just don't see it as a useful (or measurable) metric to focus on.<br /><br />Sorry if I seem overly pedantic on this point. I'm leading Kabbalat Shabbat at my shul this week :)Friar Yidhttp://friaryid.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-24483170963789718172013-02-06T16:17:48.110-05:002013-02-06T16:17:48.110-05:00Some shuls wont let any chiyuv daven unless hes ap...Some shuls wont let any chiyuv daven unless hes approved.<br /><br /><a href="http://thepartialview.blogspot.com/2013/02/crtl-c-ctrl-v-are-frum-news-sites.html" rel="nofollow">Copy and paste, frum sites boring you?</a><br />Tomim Thttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09358985107505490625noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-66715921177774939622013-02-05T18:07:20.814-05:002013-02-05T18:07:20.814-05:00Well, the fact that those in avelus have a chiyuv ...Well, the fact that those in avelus have a chiyuv to lead weekday services says it all, doesn't it?<br /><br />In your congregation, that obligation takes precedence over more subjective factors.<br /><br />In your example of the mourner who was just "doing it for his mother", who asked him why he was doing it? Depending on the personalities involved and how the question came up, I can see it potentially coming across as being really insensitive. Instead of questioning someone's motives, I think it's more useful to give someone credit for at least following this mitzvah, and perhaps see it as a sign of the "pintele Yid" being expressed. [In plain English - see this is the Jewish soul deep within being expressed even if there are surface issues clouding his relationship with G-d.]Law momhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01859590966207623757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-3629612841529546692013-02-05T17:40:43.095-05:002013-02-05T17:40:43.095-05:00Well, since we're talkin' Ortho here, obvi...Well, since we're talkin' Ortho here, obviously the Amud isn't for *me," which makes it all the more upsetting when I know that even I, the world's slowest davvener, could do a better job than the guy leading. For the record, our chazzan's voice is not much better than mine--he just *thinks* he's Yosele Rosenblatt. :(Shira Salamonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15989302669175887512noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-81737243118355436722013-02-05T15:17:55.279-05:002013-02-05T15:17:55.279-05:00Michael: A gong? I love it!
Princess: actually so...Michael: A gong? I love it!<br />Princess: actually someone in avelus, either during the shloshim or the 11 months has a chiyuv to lead services on weekedays. Just not on Shabbos or holidays unless there's no one else qualified. And no, the kid had no insight. He thought he did pretty well actually!<br /><br />Mighty Garnel Ironhearthttp://garnelironheart.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-36436657283669566692013-02-05T11:17:40.901-05:002013-02-05T11:17:40.901-05:00As my great grandfather obm once out it "אז ז...As my great grandfather obm once out it "אז זיין טאטע איז געשטארבן איז ער געווארן א יתום נישט א חזן". <br /><br />Re people who are not qualified to go up due to spiritual matters, it does bother me. There is this guy that loves going as chazan in the shul I daven in who will tell you straight out he does not believe in G-d. Additionally, he trims his beard (which I understand does not mean anything to most people, however, as he was born and raised a lubavitcher, and still considers himself one it does show on a definite lack of yiras shamayim). He loves the sound of his voice however, and therefore goes as chazan all the time. I get rather uncomfortable when he goes up...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-33064766135865016532013-02-05T10:16:49.612-05:002013-02-05T10:16:49.612-05:00Perhaps they ARE embarressed, but have no choice i...Perhaps they ARE embarressed, but have no choice in the matter. I know a guy who can't read hebrew well, but had to daven for the amud anyway, b/c he promised his dad he would do so after he passed away.FrumGeekhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13698026647411592329noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-85972763983670710472013-02-05T09:21:37.858-05:002013-02-05T09:21:37.858-05:00Unless someone out-and-out says so, one cannot cla...Unless someone out-and-out says so, one cannot claim to know if someone else believes in God. In your case, yes, he said he doesn't, but was still saying kaddish for his mother. He will be saying it for a year (hopefully) and who knows what sort of difference that will make in the long run? <br /><br />There are people out there who fast on Yom Kippur but don't keep much else. That is also a madrega. <br /><br />Look, I am a daughter of a baal tefilah and baal korei. Luke is also a baal tefilah. There is nothing I hate worse than a guy going up there and not knowing what he is doing. <br /><br />But there is a difference between saying kaddish (required) and davening for the amud (not required). (I thought those in the year can't daven for the amud, unless you mean it is the yartzheit?) <br /><br />In the cases of someone who can't say Hebrew properly, it is more that I am embarrassed for them. Seriously, why would they put themselves in that sort of situation that advertises their lack of proficiency? Does no one have busha? Princess Leahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17217157534383672867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1097749014220347853.post-42219144593596666442013-02-05T07:18:40.113-05:002013-02-05T07:18:40.113-05:00You should get together with Nusach Freak (http://...You should get together with Nusach Freak (http://nusachfreak.blogspot.co.il/) he wants to institute a Gabbai-Gong to gong sub-standard shlichei tzibur from the stage - I mean Amud.Michael Sedleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02684514303911193073noreply@blogger.com